Coach Hiring and Training Staff

[Flaming Homer]

We think it is better to have a discussion in a separate thread instead of posting all into the chat, where no one ever will find it when needed.

Our idea so far is the still use of the manual coach hiring system during the off-season.
But let every GM offer their own salary and decide how much they invest in coaches vs training staff.
We would still leave rules in place where a home team can resign is own HC no matter what if it wants to.

This "free offering" has his pro's and con's like always. For example it is not a given that a certain coach signs for the amount, even if it looks like he would in game. We would pre-select the offers and put them into the game to see if a coach signs or not.

Post all ideas here and we should be able to improve the system for next off-season.

[Silogical]

do it, shouldve been done last year before half the league locked up coaches on the expensive contracts.

[emplep7]

So this is an idea that we have wanted to implement for two off-seasons now, but have run into 2 major issues:

1. Our flat coaching rates which worked well for DDS3, no longer work due to the new training staff option and DDS does not allow you to edit these salaries like you can for players in the dB. We have had the Sim team offer shorter contracts to get out from under these contracts, but we are not quite there.

2. This is the most challenging issue - each team has different coaching/training staff budgets. We have seen one team have $20 million to offer while another team only has $3 million. In true DDS fashion this is also not editable in the dB and seems to be slightly driven by market size and attendance.

Item 2 is our biggest challenge because it means that certain teams might never have the option of a better training staff, which I personally am against. I want everyone to be on the same footing and not screw over certain teams for no fault of their own.

Additionally, this would be the framework for this system if we were to use it:

- Teams would submit .tems just like we do for DCs for coaching bids (no more manual offers)
- Teams have full autonomy to offer coaches whatever they want to offer. No min or max limits.
- Mother teams would NOT automatically sign their coaches. If the mother team offers their coach 2 million to resign and Team B offers 8 million, they are taking 8 million since DDS based it solely off of AAV.
- Team ID priority would play a role for identical offers however I see this as a non-issue since teams can offer whatever they please.

We have been in contact with Gary to find out the factors for team hiring budget which has been the biggest holdup, but continue to let us know your thoughts below.

[Jestor]

Yeah, I don't like that system at all.

You would need to have CAs like you do PAs - otherwise it'd be a wild shot in the dark as to what to offer and that would unnecessarily drag out the offseason even more, and for a comparatively minor phase.

[Silogical]

coaches are completely meaningless this is just about training staff (dont know if training staff does anything)

Not 100% sure what budget is based on but i think its based on team strength. If that's true than the budget will change year to year. If its not true than who knows how to implement a system if some teams cant use it no matter what.

[Silogical]

why is keeping the lowest training staff for everyone and lowering the injury rate to balance it out not an option?

[emplep7]

why is keeping the lowest training staff for everyone and lowering the injury rate to balance it out not an option?

My personal opinion is that’s the only option, but we want to hear everyone’s thoughts.

The training staff is a great premise but poorly programmed.

[Jestor]

why is keeping the lowest training staff for everyone and lowering the injury rate to balance it out not an option?

This is where I'm at personally. Too many problems dicking around with the coaching salaries otherwise. That part of it works great.

[Dennis]

Easy opinion from my side. If smart, no idea. Didn’t test anything.
Appears we can’t use the ingame coded thing, so that ain’t an option. However, less injuries - it’s really many minors - will only help too increase the fun for the people. So lowering the injuryrate by one level is a win win situation. We can keep the system but all (okay most i assume) GMs are happier. Just my 2 cents.

[drumr]

why is keeping the lowest training staff for everyone and lowering the injury rate to balance it out not an option?

[bt]

I don't really have an issue with the injury rate but I don't play my guys big minutes either and never really have. Or I've just been lucky but personally, I like injuries as when you're deep or have young guys down the roster, it allows them to get some minutes so I'm good with where things are.

If anything had to change because it's creating issues elsewhere (admittedly I haven't looked), probably the simple option is to just lower the injury rate slider a little bit. Admins have enough on their plate running the league then to come up with a new system when the slider might just correct it is probably the easier option.

EDIT: Lets not forget that some of us could have cried poor in DDS3 too. I can't remember how many of my post season runs were changed by Westbrook going down or Nurkic or a key player right before the playoffs which completely stuffed those runs but it happens. Means you need good depth and honestly, it's how most teams win in sports. They get lucky and have no injuries or have good depth to cover them when it counts. Look at the Heat in Finals last year or even the Sixers with Simmons, injuries keep teams out and they happen.

[OneNole]

I'm still getting my feet wet with this engine, and still have a lot to learn. While I'm someone that never had injury issues with dds3 and while I do not play my starters heavy minutes, I'm certainly not as conservative as others.

My biggest issue with the new engines injury set up is that even with a minor injury where the player is listed as probable, he still will miss the game. In dds3 there was a percentage, and I was someone who regularly played my injured players of their percentage was high enough.

Through 19 games this season, my starters have missed a combined 17 of them with these little knit knack injuries. While injuries are a part of life, it does seem to be extremely excessive. I'd guarantee if this was dds3, with those same injuries, I doubt my guys would have missed over 5 games.

So I do think something needs to be adjusted. Lr at least tested to see what injury frequency changes if the slider is moved.

[Flaming Homer]

I agree with the amount of missed time for so many small injuries. Especially if it says "prob".

And I always thought the engine just sits them not matter what. But end of last season I tried in one game and set "OUT" in the DC to very low for a guy with an injury and he was playing.
He sucked, so I never went back to try it again (maybe it was just too early in his injury) but it could be worth trying during the regular season.

[OneNole]

I tried it with Aaron Gordon already. Was listed as probable with 1 day remaining and he didnt play. Just too risky to screw up a sub matrix for a guy that likely wont play

[Flaming Homer]

True, I will test it in a standard league!!!

[GreenBear]

I agree with bt's point about injuries being a part of the game. I don’t think anyone would argue that. I had 2 playoff runs derailed in DDS3 (Austin one year, Okaro another), and I obviously had last year’s playoff run derailed in DDS19 (Shaq, who is still recovering). While it’s certainly disappointing when it happens, I actually have no issues with any of these injuries. It is a part of the game, and I was playing them all heavily being it was the playoffs at the time. But in my personal experience, there are just an egregious amount of minor injuries in the new engine. And they always seem to accumulate in a very short span (i.e. once one injury happens, I know they’re just going to keep piling up regardless of anything I do). Like a lot of things in this engine, it seems to be very streaky in that regard.

I’m quite conservative when it comes to playing time: starters are capped at 32 or less (except these past couple sims when I literally ran out of wing players due to all the injuries to the same position group), older vets (like Okaro) and rooks/sophs are usually capped at 28, I don’t play anyone more than 8 minutes in a row (and if they do play that many in a row, they get at least 4 minutes off). My FCP/DI is pretty average, my pace has typically been kept at 3. Despite that, I’d bet I’ve suffered the most injuries this season (and I’m not even counting Shaq’s pre-existing injury), although I’m hardly alone there. Keep in mind, a lot of NBA starters average 33-36 mins/game. A lot of CSL GMs play their guys even less than that (including myself) to no avail. I don’t see a ridiculous amount of long-term injuries, but I do see an incredible amount of minor ones.

Everyone has had their own experiences with this engine in regards to injuries. I don’t think I’ve ever been accused as having a depth problem. Maybe I’ve just been unlucky. Or maybe I’m doing things that increase the chance of injury without my knowledge. Although if I am, it isn’t obvious ones that I’m ignoring, and if this is the case, I wish the game would tell you which things lead to an increase in injuries (instead of each GM having their own unproven theories). Yes there are injuries in the NBA that affect championships, although I wouldn’t cite either of the past 2 seasons since the schedules have been very weird during COVID. A lot of the injuries this year have been attributed to the super condensed schedule.

I don’t know what the best solution should be. I like the idea of being able to upgrade the training staff at the expense of coaching staff (which does matter btw, although to what extent I’m unsure of), but the different teams having different budgets does complicate things. If the different budgets were based on the team’s recent success, I actually think that’s fine. It’s logical (more successful teams are going to generate more money to put back into the team) and disincentivizes tanking to a moderate degree. But if it’s based on market size, then yeah that does sound unfair. Lowering the injury rate is a possibility, but who is to say what is the appropriate percentage it should be lowered to? Just my 2 cents.

[Andrewu91]

why is keeping the lowest training staff for everyone and lowering the injury rate to balance it out not an option?

I like this idea

[KW]

I've personally never felt that injuries were too frequent in this engine or the previous. If anything, minor to moderate injuries happen more often in the NBA than here. Only part of the injuries I hate about this engine is that they took away the %s from DDS3 instead of the vague "questionable" that just seems like a weighted coin toss towards not playing.

[GreenBear]

I've personally never felt that injuries were too frequent in this engine or the previous. If anything, minor to moderate injuries happen more often in the NBA than here.

Yeah, I guess everyone has had a different experience with the injuries, and it shapes your perception. I didn't notice anything crazy with regards to injuries on DDS3, but I had a good amount last year, and I have 9 already in 20 games this year (Okaro x 2, Lawson x 2, Windler, Porter, Ingles, Bolden, and Saunders). It's gotten laughable from my end, but some other teams haven't experienced many injuries at all. I probably just offended the DDS gods somehow.

[KW]

I've personally never felt that injuries were too frequent in this engine or the previous. If anything, minor to moderate injuries happen more often in the NBA than here.

Yeah, I guess everyone has had a different experience with the injuries, and it shapes your perception. I didn't notice anything crazy with regards to injuries on DDS3, but I had a good amount last year, and I have 9 already in 20 games this year (Okaro x 2, Lawson x 2, Windler, Porter, Ingles, Bolden, and Saunders). It's gotten laughable from my end, but some other teams haven't experienced many injuries at all. I probably just offended the DDS gods somehow.

That's honestly not unrealistic. There was a stretch of games for the Hornets this season where we were down to 8 or 9 active players and missing 3-4 guys for weeks at a time (non of those being COVID absences). It does suck, but it happens. There's been instances in past seasons where NBA teams have to request emergency roster spots because they don't have 8 active players. I've never seen that here though I've gotten close once in DDS3 lol